Hi, everyone. My first post here. I would like to propose Square-1 blindfolded solving as an official event. Hopefully, the event would add more enjoyment to the competitions without much of serious drawbacks. Square-1 speed solving has been an official event and has gotten greater popularity recently. Considering the popularity of other big cube blindfolded events, such as 5x5x5 BLD, for example, it would not be a bad idea to inaugurate Square-1 BLD as well. Here are some statistics (data from WCA database): ------ Puzzle --- Number of competitors of BLD in the first year (Year) --- Numbers of competitors of speed solving (Year) ------ 4x4x4 --- 1 (2003) --- 22 (2003) 5x5x5 --- 3 (2004) --- 23 (2004), 15 (2003) Square-1 --- n/a* (2009) --- n/a (2009), 239 (2008), 72 (2007) ------ * I have heard at least 6 people (including myself) have done Square-1 BLD successfully in unofficial attempts. ------ Theoretically speaking, Square-1 BLD seems to require a different approach compared to other puzzles. Determining the corner/edge permutations for Square-1 BLD is challenging because the starting shapes are (most of the time) not squares, which, in my opinion, would create an additional appealing aspect in the blindfolded solving. I hope that more people will have more fun by introducing Square-1 BLD as an official WCA event. Thanks for your consideration.

Interesting. Although that this event seems interesting, Where is the limit to OH, blindfold and feet? If you have Blind fold for square1, will people want to have OH square 1? Will people want to have OH 5x5x5? I just think there has to be a limit on way you do an event, like blindfold square 1 I think speedsolve is good for now

When you did a Square-1 blind, what was your time? Slight tangent: I think for any new event, there should be some interest shown by organizers/competitors by holding the event unofficially. For many events, this can be done by simply following our existing procedures for speedsolving or blind, etc. For events that would require a new procedure, like speed blind, holding it unofficially first can work out the kinks before it becomes an official event. Perhaps if http://www.speedcubing.com/results/regions.php became a "proving ground" for potential new events. If a Square-1 BLD was held at an event, I'm guessing it would be entered there. But let's not create events that we can't see becoming official, like "no inspection" or the Mirror blocks.

[quote="BryanLogan":95evlvco] Perhaps if http://www.speedcubing.com/results/regions.php became a "proving ground" for potential new events. If a Square-1 BLD was held at an event, I'm guessing it would be entered there. But let's not create events that we can't see becoming official, like "no inspection" or the Mirror blocks.[/quote:95evlvco] Why not no inspection. If i remember correctly, it had 70+ people for it on speedcubing.com Also, why do you think mirror blocks will never become an official event. It to was on the website

[quote="Takao Hashimoto":2njh3455]Square-1 speed solving has been an official event and has gotten greater popularity recently. Considering the popularity of other big cube blindfolded events, such as 5x5x5 BLD, for example, it would not be a bad idea to inaugurate Square-1 BLD as well.[/quote:2njh3455] I agree, 5x5x5 BLD is not much more popular. Does the list of six successes include each of the ones from here: http://www.speedcubing.com/records/recs_bf_sq1.html ? [quote="Takao Hashimoto":2njh3455]Hopefully, the event would add more enjoyment to the competitions without much of serious drawbacks.[/quote:2njh3455] It would not be much of a problem to add this to a schedule as long as it is run in parallel with something else. I think if this was an official event, Z5 would have to be implemented because I imagine the solve times could be pretty long. [quote="cubetalk":2njh3455]Although that this event seems interesting, Where is the limit to OH, blindfold and feet?[/quote:2njh3455] One main distinction between blindfolded and the others is that it requires a different strategy. Anyone who can solve Square-1 can probably solve Square-1 OH (I won't talk about feet because I would still like to see it removed, so hopefully no more puzzles will be solved with feet. [quote="BryanLogan":2njh3455]Slight tangent: I think for any new event, there should be some interest shown by organizers/competitors by holding the event unofficially. For many events, this can be done by simply following our existing procedures for speedsolving or blind, etc. For events that would require a new procedure, like speed blind, holding it unofficially first can work out the kinks before it becomes an official event. [/quote:2njh3455] I agree with you. This is certainly better than the idea of a poll like in the 2008 Regs. Events from the unofficial page should be the pool of events the WCA can use to propose for official the next year. Final decision would be made by the WCA. [quote="cubetalk":2njh3455]Why not no inspection. If i remember correctly, it had 70+ people for it on speedcubing.com[/quote:2njh3455] How different is it from 3x3 speedsolve? For the fast guys, it adds maybe 2-3 seconds on the time. It has even been proposed in past years that 3x3 speedsolve should itself be a no inspection event. [quote="cubetalk":2njh3455]Also, why do you think mirror blocks will never become an official event. It to was on the website[/quote:2njh3455] I've looked at this. I didn't really know what it was until I looked it up, but it looks like a 3x3 cube with different-sized pieces. Is this functionally just a 3x3 cube? If we allow something like that, then should we allow the Star Wars 2x2 cubes as each different events? Back on topic. I think it is certainly too soon to add Square-1 for the 2009 Regulations, but maybe we could run it unofficially for now and come back to it later in the year for 2010 Regulations.

I think 3^3 no inspection, or puzzles which are basically 3^3s like mirror blocks, are fun to be held as unofficial events from time to time but should not become official, because they are really too close to 3^3 speedsolve. I don't want to go to a competition to solve a bunch of 3^3s and nothing else, I like more variety in puzzles. And seeing a lot of different puzzles at a competition is what gives beginners (who usually come only for 3^3 speedsolve at first) the motivation to try them too.

If we're being realistic, megaminx is almost like a 3x3x3 too. I'm not siding with anyone, just pointing it out.

Yes, megaminx is nothing else than the dodecahedric version of 3^3, but the different shape and the larger number of cubies (dodecahedronies ?) are already big differences. The solving time is much longer, the recognition is really different, the solving methods are different (ok, not really if you stick with Fridrich on both puzzles, but who knows which advanced megaminx method may show up in the future ? There are lots of still unexplored posibilities). This is really much more of a new challenge compared to 3^3 than only suppressing the inspection phase...

I would agree with holding it unofficially to gauge interest before making it official.

[quote="cubetalk":2f5b1ytq]Interesting.[/quote:2f5b1ytq] Thanks. [quote="BryanLogan":2f5b1ytq]When you did a Square-1 blind, what was your time?[/quote:2f5b1ytq] For the past several months. Usually 10-30 minutes. [quote="Bob":2f5b1ytq][quote="Takao Hashimoto":2f5b1ytq]Square-1 speed solving has been an official event and has gotten greater popularity recently. Considering the popularity of other big cube blindfolded events, such as 5x5x5 BLD, for example, it would not be a bad idea to inaugurate Square-1 BLD as well.[/quote:2f5b1ytq] I agree, 5x5x5 BLD is not much more popular. Does the list of six successes include each of the ones from here: http://www.speedcubing.com/records/recs_bf_sq1.html ?[/quote:2f5b1ytq] Yes. [quote="Bob":2f5b1ytq] [quote="Takao Hashimoto":2f5b1ytq]Hopefully, the event would add more enjoyment to the competitions without much of serious drawbacks.[/quote:2f5b1ytq] It would not be much of a problem to add this to a schedule as long as it is run in parallel with something else. I think if this was an official event, Z5 would have to be implemented because I imagine the solve times could be pretty long.[/quote:2f5b1ytq] I agree. [quote="Bob":2f5b1ytq] [quote="BryanLogan":2f5b1ytq]Slight tangent: I think for any new event, there should be some interest shown by organizers/competitors by holding the event unofficially. For many events, this can be done by simply following our existing procedures for speedsolving or blind, etc. For events that would require a new procedure, like speed blind, holding it unofficially first can work out the kinks before it becomes an official event. [/quote:2f5b1ytq] I agree with you. This is certainly better than the idea of a poll like in the 2008 Regs. Events from the unofficial page should be the pool of events the WCA can use to propose for official the next year. Final decision would be made by the WCA.[/quote:2f5b1ytq] We probably need to first hold unofficial Square-1 BLD events, then. [quote="blade740":2f5b1ytq]I would agree with holding it unofficially to gauge interest before making it official.[/quote:2f5b1ytq] You would also like to compete in the Square-1 BLD as one of the unofficial record holders, right? SF?

[quote="Takao Hashimoto":2pu70kqf] [quote="blade740":2pu70kqf]I would agree with holding it unofficially to gauge interest before making it official.[/quote:2pu70kqf] You would also like to compete in the Square-1 BLD as one of the unofficial record holders, right? SF? [/quote:2pu70kqf] Definitely.

I think we already have enough BLD events. BLD is much different than speedcubing is and it already has 4 events, why add one more which is totally not popular? It's impressive if you can solve a square-1 BLD, but nobody seems to do it and certainly not on a weekly base.

I am not against a Square-1 BLD event. But given the current strictness about adding new events, I would prefer to add new basic puzzles instead of special events for existing puzzles. Have fun, Ron

Hi Takao, As someone wrote you can do unofficial competitions. I think we need to discuss is how to list the events to be official. My suggestion is here. #1 The puzzle is commercially available worldwide. #2 Unofficial competitions have been held in more than two areas among US, Europe, and Asia. #3 More than xxx competitors competed in the world. * We may need to add some other sentences for very specific conditions. And if possible, we could provide space at WCA site for event moderators to promote new events. If we don't have such regulations, a lot of events can be suggested for official. Masayuki Akimoto

I do not think Square-1 BLD should not ever become an official event for the following reason: it is impossible to do it without solving to cube-shape and tracing the pieces. This means that the solve time is very highly dependent on how difficult the scramble is, much more so than in any other event. It is not at all hard to imagine that a competitor would take three times as long to complete a solve in the case where the shape takes 6 or 7 moves to solve, compared to a case where it is only 0 or 1 moves from the cube. So basically it becomes a competition which is mostly based on luck, where if scramble A is by far the easiest, it is practically impossible to win the event without succeeding on scramble A. In addition, square-1 is notoriously hard to scramble and it is entirely possible that different competitors will get different solves, which can affect times by several minutes. To make matters worse the official square-1 scrambler does not even display what the cube should look like! Of course, since this is a blindfolded event, it is impractical to do an average, so there really is no consistent way to compare the skill of different competitors, which makes it unsuited for an official event.

[quote="qqwref":1zgn20bs]I do [b:1zgn20bs]not[/b:1zgn20bs] think Square-1 BLD should [b:1zgn20bs]not[/b:1zgn20bs] ever become an official event[/quote:1zgn20bs] Huh? [quote="qqwref":1zgn20bs]it is impossible to do it without solving to cube-shape and tracing the pieces.[/quote:1zgn20bs] Wrong. [quote="qqwref":1zgn20bs]square-1 is notoriously hard to scramble and it is entirely possible that different competitors will get different solves[/quote:1zgn20bs] Simply make sure they get it right. Only few people would do this, and the solving time would be long enough to keep the scrambling time *relatively* short even if it includes resolving and rescrambling in case of a mistake.