I think we should make precise regulations about competitions which are at the same time Nationals and Open. I will take back the example of German Nationals 2008 : http://www.worldcubeassociation.org/res ... ermany2008 My opinion about that is to forbid any competitor to be qualified just because of his nationality. In this case, that is segregation. Thus, if 12 first competitors go to the final and there is no German in the top 12, then the german champion is the best classified German of the semi final. I also would like a rule which forbid to give trophy/prizes not to the firsts but just because of a nationality.

[quote="Edouard Chambon":asxtbmwp]I also would like a rule which forbid to give trophy/prizes not to the firsts but just because of a nationality.[/quote:asxtbmwp] Why? That would just drive sponsors to have more closed competitions. Not everyone is going to get a prize anyways, so many people are already going home with just the experience and their times in the WCA database.

I agree about advancement of competitors, but isn't that not supposed to happen already? I guess it wouldn't hurt to make it explicit, but I don't think it is allowed under the current regulations. I don't have a problem with it if it is clearly announced beforehand. Example: The US winner at US Nationals 2007 received a trip to Budapest for WC2007. Do you think if Lars V. won that he deserved this trip? The purpose of the trip is to promote cubing in the United States and was donated by the U.S. distributor (if I remember correctly). If French Nationals was open and I went and won and top prize (let's just say that it is a trip to WC 2009), do you think Winning Moves France would want me to have it? I would understand that they would not. This is sort of the compromise between open & closed competitions. I think if the prize for the US Nationals & Open had to be given to #1 regardless of nationality, there would be a greater probability that the competition would be closed.

i agree with just about everything proposed. advancement and prizes should ONLY be based off of achievement. the only exception is the title/prizes that go with a national champion. if there is an award that goes along with the title of 'national champion', then obviously it should go to that competitor regardless of their overall place in the competition. however any and all other instances of prizes should be given based off of achievement at that particular competition. (ie no prizes for 2nd/3rd place based off of nationality, unless they were 2nd/3rd in the event based off times anyway) i think this is segregation in all cases, not just this particular example, and it very closely parallels the open/closed debate going on right now, which is why i find it funny we agree so closely here, but not in the other thread.

[quote="rxdeath":1g5147lf]however any and all other instances of prizes should be given based off of achievement at that particular competition. (ie no prizes for 2nd/3rd place based off of nationality, unless they were 2nd/3rd in the event based off times anyway).[/quote:1g5147lf] Wait a minute, what if you're running, oh, I dunno, the U.S. Nationals, and the top 3 Megaminx results are (say) Stefan Pochmann, Dan Cohen, and Timothy Sun? Pochmann isn't American, so the 1st prize should go to Dan Cohen. But should he get the 2nd prize trophy too? That's silly. If you're going to give out a first prize to the best competitor from your country, the second and third prizes (if awarded) should follow exactly the same logic.

no what i think would be this in yoru hypothetical situation: stefan would get the first place trophy/prize, dan the second place trophy/prize, timothy the third place trophy/prize. if there was a special award (ie cash, trip, etc..) for the us megaminx champion, then it would go to dan.

How about the WCA doesn't regulate prizes? Just let organizers handle it. If someone wants to give a prize to the guy with a 20.09 solve just for getting a 20.09 solve, that's their call. If the organizer wants to give a $20 cash prize to 2nd in 3x3 bld but nothing to the winner of 3x3 bld, that's their call. People may think it's stupid, but any regulation on prizes is unenforceable--the organizer could pull the person aside later to give the prize. And don't force organizers to give certain kinds of prizes--just let the organizer do what they want.

I agree with you Tim. The organizer is putting on the competition. Why should they not be able to distribute their prizes as they please (especially if they are the one providing them)?

Yes, I agree that there should be not regulations on which prizes to award to whom based on what. Maybe next time I want to give a prize to the worst female competitor. Ron **