I was the judge for the FMC at the US Open. There seemed to be some assumptions from people that after the 60 minutes was done, they were able to copy their solution down to the official score sheet. Other competitions thought they should have had this done by the 60 minutes, so they started copying at the 5 minute warning. Proposed ammendments: E2g) The judge will announce the time remaining at ?15? minute intervals. They will also announce at 5, 2, and 1 minute left. The judge will also count down the last 10 seconds. E2h) At the end of 60 minutes, the judge will announce "Stop". All competitiors must put down their pens. Any writing after this will result in disqualification.

I back this up. At the end of FMC it mostly depends on which sheet the judge picks up first on how many time there is left. The inforcement of the limit is quite bad. Therefore I support that proposal Bryan made with the addition that the time limit must be judged a bit more strictly. How about everyone must place his hands flat on the table until the judge picked up your paper?

Better yet, when your done, hold up your sheet that you want the judge to take. Should FMC also have a limit? We don't allow someone who takes 11 minutes on 3x3x3, why should we allow a 100 FMC solution. It's just a waste of time to judge.

There are 159 FMC results in the database, of those only the last 12 are 60+ turns and only the last 4 are 70+ turns = limits are not needed, we would not gain much but prevent people from having fun.

Yes, it should be very clear that the solution must be done at the end of 60 minutes. In other words, pencils down. The penalty should be disqualification. If an old lady proctoring the SAT (standardized test in the United States) can enforce this, I'm sure all the strength and intimidation of the FMC judge can do the same. Solutions over 60 moves really are a waste of time, as the average Fridrich solve takes 57 moves, but I think people are generally all right at determining if they are competent to compete in this event. I think the time taken to judge a 100+ move scramble really isn't much longer than the time taken to judge a 60 move scramble. (It also gives the judges something to curse about after the competition.)

[quote="Tyson":2cnjik3b]Yes, it should be very clear that the solution must be done at the end of 60 minutes.[/quote:2cnjik3b] E2c) At the end of the 60 minutes the competitor must have his solution written down clearly for the judge, notation according to Article 12. Yup, all fine here. -Chris K

[quote="cada":2my6jlmx][quote="Tyson":2my6jlmx]Yes, it should be very clear that the solution must be done at the end of 60 minutes.[/quote:2my6jlmx] E2c) At the end of the 60 minutes the competitor must have his solution written down clearly for the judge, notation according to Article 12. Yup, all fine here. -Chris K[/quote:2my6jlmx] "It's written down, I just need to transfer it." While E2c does seem to cover it, it would be good to say that you must be done writing and explain the penalty for continued writing.

Maye just change the wording to, "Written down on the competition score sheet" so that transferring is not allowed. The problem of course with transferring is that someone who misses a ' or a 2 might add it in during the transfer process. And it's really not fair. It's not like after a math test, I get to re-write everything for the teacher.

[quote="Kenneth Gustavsson":1ru435mc]There are 159 FMC results in the database, of those only the last 12 are 60+ turns and only the last 4 are 70+ turns = limits are not needed, we would not gain much but prevent people from having fun.[/quote:1ru435mc] Wrong (and the maximum so far was [url=http://www.worldcubeassociation.org/results/p.php?i=2008KIRC01#333fm:1ru435mc]102 moves[/url:1ru435mc]). I strongly support the "hold the paper up" requirement, right now playing by the rules gives you a disadvantage as many people do exploit the extra time it takes the judge to get to them. And every one of them delays the judge further, giving the people afterwards even more time to cheat. I also suggest to have several judges for collecting the answers so that each judge collects at most let's say five solutions. Each judge should know exactly which few people he's responsible for and should stand ready at 60 minutes, so that collecting the solutions goes fast and competitors can't "switch to the slower judge". And if someone doesn't hold his solution up when his judge approaches him... DNF!

I think to change about sending score sheet. It isn't just to take WCA score sheet. but competitor must move from table and send it to judge in 60 minutes. When finish time the judge must not take other score sheet. so competitior have to plan time to think, write and sending score sheet. And if sometime competitor want to copy his solution then he will can after finish round.

I added: E2b1) A judge should announce the remaining time after 30 minutes, 50 minutes, 55 minutes and 59 minutes, and 'Stop' at 60 minutes. and a penalty for writing after the end of the 60 minutes. The other suggestions are good, but IMO do not need to be in the regulations. We are not going to give a penalty if someone forgets to hold up his/her paper. Thanks, Ron

I have competed three times in Fewest Moves so far, and every time, I was given 1 sheet with specific boxes or dashes on/in which to write down the moves of the solution. This type of sheet makes it very hard for the competitor to change a solution once it is written down in the form that is expected. If the rules are going to allow such awful forms to be used, the competitor should at least be guaranteed that he/she be allowed to have multiple copies of the form and to be able to select which one he wants to submit for his/her final solution within the last few seconds of the 1 hour period. Below I quote comments I made on the speedsolving.com forum. As a competitor I expect to be able to write down a solution I might come up with early on so it is ready to turn in if I don't come up with something later on. If I do come up with a better solution later on, I should be able to write that in without running out of space on the form. If competitors are allowed to have multiple forms, but only turn in one of them, that perhaps would be a lot better than having just a single form of 104 positions in which to write down moves. The other reason is that it might be desirable to have more positions (or allow "free form") is to be able to add an insertion into a solution already written down. To be able to add an insertion at an arbitrary point in a solution would require leaving a lot of positions blank over the entire solution, probably using only every other row, and not using the entire rows of those used. This might allow the competitor to alter a solution already written down with a rather minimal amount of crossing out of the initial solution. But it still means the user must "waste" the space on the form, and need a lot more positions on the form than the actual length of the solution found. Telling the competitor to only write down the solution on the form at the end of the hour requires the user to estimate the amount of time needed to write down the solution. If the competitor fails to allow enough time at the end, he/she will end up with a DNF when he/she should have been able to turn in a solution. If he/she overestimates the time required, the extra time is basically lost time for the competitor. It is very annoying for the competitor to have to make this kind of judgment on the use of the time.

A question: Are competitors allowed to refer to Article 12 during fewest moves?

[quote="Bob":2q4hgahm]A question: Are competitors allowed to refer to Article 12 during fewest moves?[/quote:2q4hgahm] I guess I don't see why not. I've had competitors ask me about notation before (cube turns, and what the ^2 or ^3 means on a scramble), and told them. I don't see why we can't allow competitors to have a copy of Art. 12.